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Un alpinist lasat sa moara, Imagini Socante

Victoras2001
post 20 Feb 2009, 13:07
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Sase oameni l-ar fi carat. Nu erau la 8 000m. Oricum, e cutremuratoare imaginea a sase oameni care nici macar sa-i spuna o vorba n-au catadicsit. Stateau si se uitau ca la o gaina, asteptand sa nu mai topaie fara cap prin curte.


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VladG
post 20 Feb 2009, 13:19
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Nu vreau sa intru intr-o polemica.
Tot ce am vrut sa zic e ca nu putem acuza vehement pe cineva doar vazand niste imagini.
Nu conteaza ca nu erau 8000m. Putea fi un varf mai putin inalt, dar dificil.
Matterhornul e mai scund ca Mont Balncul, dar mult mai dificil.
E tragic ce s-a intamplat si n-as vrea sa fiu in locul salvamontistilor, caci sunt sigur ca nu le-a fost deloc usor.


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Serje
post 20 Feb 2009, 14:52
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QUOTE(dragos62 @ 20 Feb 2009, 10:44)
Din spatele monitorului cum stam noi acum  se ved alfel asemenea cazuri...e cald,stam comod intr-un scaun cu cana de cafea aburinda intr-o parte si eventual cu tigarea fumegand in scrumiera wink.gif
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Unii o vazut prea multe filme cu Bruce Willis sau s-o uitat prea mult la Jack Bauer...


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semit
post 20 Feb 2009, 15:25
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In primul rand, Dumnezeu sa-l ierte!
In al doilea rand, intreb si eu ca proasta, daca statea el linistit la el acasa mai patea ce a patit? ma indoiesc, cum zicea si argon la inceput, cand alegi drumul asta iti asumi riscurile, el si le-a asumat. punct


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VladG
post 20 Feb 2009, 15:45
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Va recomand filmul "Touching the Void ". Finalul lui e unul fericit.
Diferenta e ca cel accidentat mai poate face cate ceva in ajutorul sau, nu e o "masa inerta".
Se poate vedea cam ce inseamna o coborare periculoasa.

This post has been edited by VladG: 20 Feb 2009, 15:47


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adrian mgn
post 20 Feb 2009, 15:47
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ca in unele situatii limita trebuie sacrificata o viata pt. a salva multe altele ... e un fapt stiut ... nu are rost sa discut despre asta.
insa faptul ca vad cum un om trage cu o cordelina un viitor mort ... si alti 6-7 stau si se uita ... ma face sa ma indoiesc de profesionalismul lor.
si decat sa-l lase asa in agonie sa moara ... mai bine il executau scurt cu un piolet in cap.


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VladG
post 20 Feb 2009, 15:58
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Hai, mai! Tu ai fi ridicat pioletul ala?
Cred ca ar fi interesant ce cred alpinistii profesionisti despre episodul asta.

Si eu ma intreb de ce-l trageau cu coarda aia? Poate o repetitie ptr modul cum l-ar fi coborat, daca reactiona pozitiv? Nu stiu...

This post has been edited by VladG: 20 Feb 2009, 16:02


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adrian mgn
post 20 Feb 2009, 16:00
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era ... asa ... o formulare retorica.eu imi doresc sa nu ajung vreodata in situatia de a lua astfel de hotarari.

This post has been edited by adrian mgn: 20 Feb 2009, 16:00


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IRONICK
post 20 Feb 2009, 16:16
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In procent destul de mare, numai impresii de pantofari pe aici. Gresesc cumva?

This post has been edited by IRONICK: 20 Feb 2009, 17:57


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Lostboy
post 20 Feb 2009, 16:19
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Să avem pardon, unii ”are șlapi”!

This post has been edited by Lostboy: 20 Feb 2009, 16:20


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St
post 21 Feb 2009, 13:25
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Din cati alpinisti cunosc eu toti sunt oameni de mare caracter, si nu ar lasa un om sa moara pe munte daca ar avea macar 1% sanse sa-l salveze. Asta referitor la romani, ca straini n-am avut ocazia sa cunosc.
Nu inteleg de ce in trag cu o sfoara "ca pe vita la taiat" cum zice cineva mai sus. Si de ce merg spre varf? Ca eu in video vad ca urca, in nici un caz nu coboara.

This post has been edited by St: 21 Feb 2009, 13:27


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BogdanX
post 21 Feb 2009, 13:54
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Sursa

Campanini's father, who uploaded the video after receiving it anonymously, has launched a lawsuit, accusing the rescuers of abandoning his son.

“They went looking for a corpse and they found a survivor,” Carlos Campanini told reporters.

The video shows the struggle to bring the visibly weakened Frederico Campanini down from near the top of Aconcagua, the highest mountain in the Americas with a height of 6962m.

He was declared dead on the night of January 8 of fluid in the lungs, hypothermia and dehydration days after getting caught in a storm on the way down from the summit.

A 38-year-old Italian woman in the five-person group he was leading, Elena Senin, also died.

In the video taken before Campanini's death, a rescuer says to the camera: “He's not moving. I've asked permission from the judge (to abandon him).”

It was not clear which judge was being referred to, but the rescuer used the Spanish “jueza”, meaning a female magistrate.

In the next shot, Campanini is seen trying to get up in the snow.

“That's it,” the cameraman is heard saying.

“Get up, you idiot,” another rescuer says.

“Go, damn it,” a rescuer says. Then: “Move, idiot!”

The cameraman is heard praying. “God, give him strength, please.”

Campanini weakly stirs, and the rescuers pull vainly on a rope tied around his waist.

The debate on the operation has focused on the rescue team being seemingly unprepared to find the guide alive.

The team had no oxygen for him, nor a thermal sleeping bag or stretcher to carry him.

The rescuers also had to climb back up to the summit to look for another path down -- a difficult feat in itself in the thin atmosphere and one made all the more taxing by having to pull the listless guide.

“We've gone 10 metres, we can't go any further,” the cameraman says after a cut in the video. The rescuers talk about setting up a tent. One says: “We are also fighting for our own lives.”

A rescuer talks in his radio. “Tell them he's dying. He won't last much longer. In 40 minutes he'll be dead.”

The cameraman is heard crying. A rescuer says: “Come on Frederico, you idiot.”

Then the video shows the guide lying alone in the snow some distance away.

He was not moving. It could not be seen whether he was abandoned alive or dead.


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bendix
post 22 Feb 2009, 19:58
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Nu sunt alpinist, dar inca am un cap pe umeri si pot sa formulez niste deductii logice. Asadar: decat cu asemenea salvamontisti pe muntele ala, eu zic ca e mai bine fara !


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romanvs
post 22 Feb 2009, 20:44
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Am vazut niste interviuri cu niste salvamontisti romani dupa cazul asta si au spus ca in astfel de cazuri se respecta niste "legi ale muntelui" si ca nu se pun in pericol vietile celor sanatosi pt persoanele care sunt pe moarte.
Alpinistii isi asuma niste riscuri in escalade.
La altitudini mari aerul este rarefiat(risc de hipoxie(lipsa oxigen la nivelul creierului)) ,este foarte frig(hipotermie(hipotermia mimeaza moartea)) si intr-un film am vazut ca exista riscul de embolie pulmonara(asta in film nu stiu daca e la fel si in realitate si mai ales la ce altitudini).

Ce am mai inteles de la TV este ca salvamontistii plecasera sa recupereze cadavrele si nu ar fi avut echipamentul necesar pt salvare si acordare a primului ajutor.

In timpul filmarii se poate observa felul in care respira cel care filmeaza,deci nu ii erea usor sa respire(nu respira normal,respira greu).

This post has been edited by romanvs: 22 Feb 2009, 21:11


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bulan
post 23 Feb 2009, 17:06
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Ce invataminte tragem noi din acest evenemient?Nu se pleaca la drum cu ghizi incapabili si sifonari capabili!!!


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Smiley
post 26 Feb 2009, 10:08
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intotdeauna determinarea echipei de salvare face diferenta intre viata si moarte. vezi cazurile David Sharp si Lincoln_Hall

primul a fost lasat sa moara, au trecut pe langa el o multime de "alpinisti" (care si-au continuat linistiti ascensiunea) si toti au spus "era pe moarte, nu aveam cum sa-l salvam la altitudinea aia".
al doilea a fost parasit de echipa la o altitudine mai mare decat primul, declarat mort, dar a fost gasit a 2-a zi de o alta echipa, intr-o conditie cel putin la fel de grava ca si David Sharp(nu mai avea echipament, avea halucinatii) dar a fost coborat in siguranta si salvat.

This post has been edited by Smiley: 26 Feb 2009, 10:16


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